IS BOB MCDONNELL PLANNING A MIDDLE CLASS TAX HIKE?!?!

WATCH YOUR WALLETS.

Comments

[Not Larry Sabato]

Hat Tip To Brian Devine (http://twitter.com/briandevine/status/2207174008) who linked to Vivian Paige (http://blog.vivianpaige.com/2009/06/17/mcdonnell-wont-sign-no-tax-pledge/) who saw this from Bob Holsworth: (http://virginiatomorrow.com/2009/06/17/the-washington-times-bashes-mcdonnell-for-not-taking-the-pledge/)

[Salem Republicans]

Because he won't sign one of these stupid pledges? Good luck with that line of attack when Bob McDonnell has consistently voted for lower taxes and Creigh Deeds voted for a huge gas tax increase when gas was over $4.00/gallon. Please, please, please make this election about taxes.

[Not Larry Sabato]

By stupid pledge, you mean the one signed by Salem Republican and Majority Leader Morgan Griffith?

Are you calling Morgan stupid?

[Salem Republicans]

I'm calling the pledges stupid, not Morgan. Politicians sign these dumb pledges everyday. McDonnell should be commended for not doing so. I may be in the minority amongst my R brethren but I'm tired of special interest groups (on both sides of the aisle) holding our leaders hostage with all sorts of pledges.

[informed voter]

No we're not calling Morgan stupid. We are calling people like you stupid when you try to create an issue by saying that just because someone will not sign a pledge that they are against the issue.

[Salem Republicans]

Oh, and by the way, this isn't the first, and certainly won't be the last, time that Morgan and I have disagreed on something. Frankly, I think it's one of the reasons the Republican Party is so healthy in Salem and the Roanoke Valley...we aren't all simply lock step followers of our electeds.

[Not John S. Mosby]

Salem R, unfortunately most Republicans disagree with you. They prefer to spend and borrow their way to a free lunch today without thinking about the future. To ensure this, they try and nail down any candidate with the pledge stuff. Pledge to be this, pledge to be that. Don't think, just stick to the script.

[Not Larry Sabato]

Maybe I am dense, but I don't see how he can sign something "stupid" without you thinking he made a stupid decision. :-)

[Salem Republicans]

Ben - It is smart for someone like Morgan to sign it because it's a good move politically.

That's doesn't mean I have to like it philosophically and being a smart move politically doesn't change the fact that pledges are stupid and I'm tired of them.

Thanks to Bob McDonnell for refusing to sign but more importantly for having a records of fiscal restraint and common sense, unlike Creigh Deeds.

[Ron Brandon]

You mean like the "pledge" Bob took to "uphold and defend the constitution" then Bob-0 went about creating the regional taxing authorities that were ruled "unconsititutional" by the State Supreme Court?

Why ask someone to take a pledge when they have no intention of keeping it?

[Not John S. Mosby]

Salem R, it sounds like you're all for cutting taxes but find the concept of someone having to make a pledge to do so is stupid. Correct? In that case Ben it makes sense and is not contradictory.

[Salem Republicans]

NJSM - That's essentially my point. I've made 3 pledges in my life. To my God, to my wife and to my profession (part of becoming a member of the VA Bar). Pledges involving specific policy points with no ability to predict the future are just dumb to me.

I can't imagine the scenario where I'd support actions contrary to what that particular pledge seeks. That said, allowing yourself to be held hostage by a special interest group is philosophically problematic to me and I simply wouldn't do it. Of course, that's easy for me to say since I'm not running for anything.

[Not John S. Mosby]

A pragmatic Republican? Let us know when RPV casts you out, between you and Loudoun Insider Democrats will have to set up a political refugee camp, seeing as you're no longer pure Republican and everything.

[Salem Republicans]

NJSM - While I suppose we could both be called "pragmatic," LI and I disagree on many policy issues so I wouldn't put us in the same camp. Furthermore, while I'm a local Committee Chair, I can only speak for myself.

I'm as conservative as they come but I don't come to those beliefs because some special interest group told me to think that way. I know what I believe, I'm willing to defend what I believe and I don't need third-party permission or pledges to justify/defend my beliefs.

[Loudoun Insider]

That's pretty funny NJSM! Salem R is a great man.

I will call Morgan Griffith stupid, BTW. He was a huge Jeff Frederick supporter, after all.

[J. Tyler Ballance]

The recent "Regional Taxing Authority" debacle, was a direct result of Republican Delegates who were seeking ways to meet transportation needs, without being seen as violating their respective no tax pledges.

Bob McDonnell is right not to sign such a ludicrous pledge. None of us knows the future. Even the most fiscally stingy official may need to support changes to the tax code in response to emerging needs.

The, "No Tax Pledge" and similar movements that try to get elected officials to tie their hands prior to entering office are misguided and, promote bad governance.

[bobs for ???]

The pledge isn't the issue. The bigger problem is that Bob McDonnell doesn't know what he believes in anymore.

But hey, that's what happens when you try to give yourself a political makeover. I expect a lot more of these Romney-esque moments in the coming months.

[David Englin]

Maybe he'll embrace the Middle Class and Small Business Tax Relief Act that many of us Democrats have been pushing for months:
http://www.davidenglin.org/taxrelief/
http://tinyurl.com/ludcuw

It provides much-needed help to the poor and the middle class and to small businesses struggling to employ people, it protects existing money for education and transportation, and we even designed it to be net tax and revenue neutral (any "excess" revenue goes to car tax relief) as an olive branch to the No Tax Pledge crowd.

[change]

Mosby,
What planet are you living on? I think you meant to say that democrats are spending away our future. Maybe you should study up on the issues a bit more and then come back with some informed posts. People like you spout sound bites from your liberal sources and look stupid when they are proven wrong. You really should stop embarrassing yourself with your ignorance.

[bubba]

Wow. Good move for Bob. Shows me that, at least at this point, he is more interested in being Governor than in being a pretty candidate for Governor.

Could this be the first time in like forever that we have two full blown adults running for Governor?

[Not John S. Mosby]

Change, I seem to remember Federal spending going up a bit during the Bush administration, and the deficit went up a bit too. Maybe it's just me though, and Republicans like Reagan, Bush I and Bush II had balanced budgets and cut government spending. Or is that just Republican fantasyland memories?

[Bubby Hussein, Hillbilly Sheikh]

BobO won't have to do a thing, Griffith will have his no-tax pledgers kill statewide taxes and we'll all pay higher local property taxes to keep our schools funded and the sheriff's office open. That's how Republican's govern.

[Salem Republicans]

Time to clear up a factual error, apparently Morgan Griffith has never in his life signed a "no tax pledge." Ben, if you have evidence to the contrary, please post it.

[Brian]

Wow, Ben I never knew that you thought so much of the WaTimes.

How's your boy, Macker, doing? Hard to believe that he lost to Creightard, huh? (Especially when had your vaunted endorsement.)

Nice intentional obtuseness above, BTW.

[Bwana]

This is unfortunately the type of silliness that will be foisted on the public until election day.

McDonnell doesn't take the pledge, so Ben alleges a middle class tax increase.

If McDonnell had taken the pledge, Ben would respond that McDonnell was the prisoner of Right wing Cro Magnons who were against any tax hike at any time, unlike the enlightened Warner-Kaine administrations.

Normally we have to wait for Labor Day for this type of silliness.

[Mr. GOP]

ONCE AGAIN NLS SHOUTS INSIGNIFICANCE. Pa-leezzzeee Ben, try Ritalin. It might help to calm you down.

The pledge question is perennial. Now politicians are asked to take tax pledges, education pledges, equality hiring pledges, environmental pledges, redistricting pledges, and pledges keep pledges. Good grief. McDonnell and all politicians should try a new technique that might actually benefit all concerned; let their word be their bond.

As far as I’m concerned, I want McDonnell to take one pledge, and only one pledge and here it is:

“I do solemnly swear that I will support the Constitution of the United States, and the Constitution of the Commonwealth of Virginia, and that I will faithfully and impartially discharge all the duties incumbent upon me as Governor, according to the best of my ability so help me God.”

And then do the things he says he will do, according to his promises. I don’t need him to take 15 pledges to satisfy some stringent keeper of truth on either side of the aisle.

I want the man to govern using common sense conservative approaches, not explode government like the Democrats love to do…witness O-blah-blah as he single handedly destroys the auto industry, the medical industry, and small businesses. (Never mind Iraq and North Korea are falling apart while he flies to the Big Apple or Chi-town for dinner with the miz at $250,000 per hour). Now if you want to SCREAM, Ben, strain you vocal cords there. Not on this silly, and it is silly, discussion of pledges.

[change]

Mosby,
Nice memory, does it go so deep to remember what party controlled the purse strings at the time? (I’ll give you a hint it the name starts with “demo” and ends with “crats”. In fact they have pretty much “demo-ed” the entire private financial, automotive, and are working on the sectors they have missed, most notably healthcare.
Nevertheless, there is an extreme difference between “a bit” and “abuse”, I believe any thinking person who was against that spending must be against tripling the national debt… are you?

Oh but Obama’s spending is helping to create jobs.. oops unemployment went up 30%

Oh, and fix the financial crisis… oops my 401k is lower than before.

Oh, and fix the housing issue.. ops my house is worth less than it was 6 months ago.
I could go on but I am feeling a bit wheezy

Not to worry, as long as you keep telling people everything is great, most of them will believe it. (at least the uninformed morons that regurgitate talking points like a cow with cud.
I would call these types lemmings but the real lemmings are beginning to get aggravated at the use of their name.
Ignorance is one thing, intentional blind ignorance does nothing to further what our country can be.
Maybe it’s time for thinking people to begin thinking again.

[Not John S. Mosby]

Well, I remember the Republicans controlling the House of Representatives from 2001 until 2007. I remember them controlling the Senate, except for a bit there in 2001, for the same time as well. I seem to remember them also controlling the Senate for times back in the 80s as well.

As far as your other turds, I mean, points, my 401k is actually up about 10% since Obama took office on Jan 20th. Still down quite a bit from the late summer, I think Bush was in charge when the economy collapsed, correct?

I seem to remember houses peaking in price around the spring of 2006, then have been dropping steadily since then. I don't think Obama was President in the spring of 2006, nor did Democrats control either house of Congress.

As far as unemployment goes, again, the economic collapse started before Jan 20th, 2009. Not exactly Obama's fault.

[bubba]

Any attempt to "nationalize" this gubernatorial election will do a disservice to the commonwealth.

This election, like all state elections, matters to us for the next four years. It only matters to the national monied interests for the month of november.

We need to do our best to keep the candidates focused on what matters to Virginians and what a governor actually does.

FOR INSTANCE - we need an adult, mature, realistic, and responsible solution to dealing with transportation in the state. The national folks don't care one wink about that issue in Virginia (all they care about is proving that Virginia is blue or Virginia is red on a national map), but our economic competitiveness demands a solution, and soon.

[change]

Mosby
Your selective memory is a convenient truth. Your 401k went down when democrats were in charge of the purse strings.
Housing prices steadily dropping since 06? Dems in charge of the purse strings.
Unemployment speaks for itself…

Apparently nothing is Obamba’s fault.

Take another sip of the kook aid.. you are a great lemming. (no insult to lemmings)
Your type of ignorance is the most welcome attitude to those who wish to control you.
Practice the mantra “thank you sir may I have another”…
On a personal note; maybe you should just be quiet; and you will look less ignorant. I hate to see you embarrass yourself like this.

[Rtwng Extrmst]

NJS Mosby,

You say about "most Republicans": "They prefer to spend and borrow their way to a free lunch today without thinking about the future."

So I suspect you prefer the Democrat method of quadrupling the spending we saw under Republicans, also "without thinking of the future"?

Sorry, true conservative Republicans are against government growth and for fiscal solvency. That means cutting spending as well as taxes. The fact that we have not had a Congress or President controlled by conservatives in recent memory is no reason to besmirch the reputations of "most Republicans". More accurately its a minority of Republicans in league with a majority of Democrats that have led to the increased deficits you speak of.

Personally, I have no problem with McDonnell not signing a pledge as long as he tells us what he will do. It sounds to me like we will be hearing about that in the coming weeks. Pledges tend not to be worth much if you can't trust the person who makes them. See Obama's pledges to "scrub the budget" and "make cuts for every increase" if you need proof. I find the No Tax Increase pledges lacking. I'd rather see a pledge to not increase taxes and to make at least an equal cut in spending for every increase.

[Not John S. Mosby]

So, Bush was in league with Democrats during his 8 years in office and not "true conservative Republicans". That's the story, and your sticking with it? The economy collapsed because of two years of Democratic control of Congress and not the 8 years of a Republican President along with 6 years of Republican control of Congress. That's it? If Republicans had maintained Congress, the economy would have never dropped like it did?

[teabag utopia]

It's a cliche, but it's true - Republicans campaign saying government doesn't work, and then, if they win, they prove it.

No governor - of either party - will ever, ever cut spending. The best you can do is slow it down. And Bob wouldn't even do that, because he would want (surprise!) a legacy.

Right-wingers - if your bizarre, half-baked, teabagging/Glenn-Beck vision of governance was ever actually put into action, we'd do what, exactly? Gut all government services? Sit around on our rooftops with shotguns, guarding our canned food and waiting for Jesus?

You really want to pave your own street or purify your own water? Good luck! It's not as easy as teaching your kids fake science.

[Rtwng Extrmst]

Hey teabag...

The spending going on now by Dems is proof of the fact that we don't need half of what they spend it on! At the Federal level alone we have failed social security, failed school programs, failed medicare, these are all examples of gov't run amok, and now they want the gov't to totally run healthcare! Gov't has it's purpose and I promise you it's less than half of what we fund it for, particularly at the Federal level.

NJS Mosby,

"So, Bush was in league with Democrats during his 8 years in office and not "true conservative Republicans". "

Actually yes, ever heard of McCain-Feingold and McCain-Kennedy? Those are just two examples. There are many "moderate" Republicans who worked with Dems to bring this largesse. Bush was not a conservative on economic policy. He did cut taxes and that revived the economy, but he never fought to actually reduce the size of government. This is one of my biggest complaints about the guy.

The domino effect that caused the state of the economy today can largely be put at the feet of actions in Congress to create cheap credit for risky real estate investors and a lack of back-bone by gov't to stop that when it was clear we were running into problems because of this in the financial markets. The only ones blowing the whistle were Republicans and the Dems, who had control of the congress by then shouted down the whistleblowers as "racists". So while I'm not happy the Republicans didn't stick to their guns, I'm more mad at Dems for looking the other way in order to line their pockets with political donations from their friends in large financial institutions.

[teabag utopia]

I'm not saying massive government spending is good, I'm just saying your candidates are lying to you when they say'll they'll make it stop. At least Dems are up front about it.

Indeed, since George W. Bush was quite the big spender himself, I'd say you guys have got a long, looong road back to credibility on fiscal issues. Hell, Bush is the one who first started the bailouts.

But if Bob does in fact wants to cut spending, seems like the obvious question is: what's he going to cut? Fat chance he'll answer that on the campaign trail.

It's like abortion - remember when the GOP had complete control of all three branches of government, and somehow Roe v. Wade stayed legal?

Yeah. You've been had.

[Rtwng Extrmst]

Teabag,

First, "I'm not saying massive government spending is good, I'm just saying your candidates are lying to you when they say'll they'll make it stop. At least Dems are up front about it."

So we should all just give in to the notion of larger and larger gov't and higher and higher taxes??? Please! There are politicians who abide by their promises. Can they guarantee they will fix it, no, because that would take a dictatorship (I know Barack is trying, but he's not there yet). It takes coalitions to make changes in gov't and it will take time and effort to build one that will cut the size of gov't.

Second on Abortion... You ever heard of something called the US Supreme Court? Until there are 5 Justices on that court that believe innocent human life should be protected at all phases of development, we will not see a change here. It has nothing to do with "being had", except that Libs dominate the court and yes I guess you could say we've "been had" by them.

[steve vaughan]

Re: Moran Griffith's supidity.
He's not stupid. He just has a 100% interest in politics and 0% interest in government.

[change]

mosby;
"If Republicans had maintained Congress, the economy would have never dropped like it did?"

a four letter word (according to Biden math)answer to your question is YES

[I.Publius]

Would Ben's hero, T-Douchebag, have signed such a pledge? Dumbest post of the month. Way to go.

[Not John S. Mosby]

Change,

And what would the Republican congress have done that would have prevented it? The real estate markets started dropping in spring/summer of 2006 - 4-6 months before the elections and 6-8 months before Democrats took charge in January 2007.

[change]

mosby,
go back and check out how many times the dems were warned about the problem, it will answer the question for you